When will the update be published ??

All problems and technical questions concerning our Cessna O-1/L-19 Bird Dog are discussed here.
Locked
Dag
Posts: 24
Joined: 06 Sep 2006, 23:38

When will the update be published ??

Post by Dag » 28 Mar 2010, 13:57

Hi,

I have 6 repaints for the promised military O-1A model on wheels with helmeted pilot and no tow gear at the tail wheel. I was wondering when this model and all other updates to the Birddog will be published.
I am not interested in a reply from a beta tester, I want a reply from a developer.

If the above model isn't available in due course I will need to adapt the repaints to other models and this will make them inaccurate.

Thanks
Best regards
Dag

madia84
Posts: 8
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 19:48

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by madia84 » 28 Mar 2010, 14:51

Hello Dag

We have the same problem; as for me I have eleven repaints in French Army Aviation markings. But those people at Sibwings definitely seem to be more interested in taking our money than in making things accurate.

User avatar
Andrey
Site Admin
Posts: 834
Joined: 18 Sep 2005, 12:51
Location: Siberia
Contact:

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by Andrey » 28 Mar 2010, 14:52

Hello Dag!

It will be published as soon as it will be ready :) Did you expect another answer ? Now we are in negotiations with flight dynamic people, how much it will take I can't even suppose.

Andrey
Image
We are at facebook: facebook.com/sibwings

User avatar
Andrey
Site Admin
Posts: 834
Joined: 18 Sep 2005, 12:51
Location: Siberia
Contact:

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by Andrey » 28 Mar 2010, 15:03

Michel,
If you think FS market bring good money - welcome - we'll be glad to see, to test, to critic your payware addons ;)

As for cfg see no problem to publish your repaints with notice that it was creaed for a.mdl and note that maybe update will include more suitable mdl (we'll do not much changes in mdls, just military pilots and probable different antennas)

Andrey
Image
We are at facebook: facebook.com/sibwings

Dag
Posts: 24
Joined: 06 Sep 2006, 23:38

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by Dag » 28 Mar 2010, 22:37

Andrey wrote:Hello Dag!

It will be published as soon as it will be ready :) Did you expect another answer ? Now we are in negotiations with flight dynamic people, how much it will take I can't even suppose.

Andrey
Yes Andrey, I was expecting an approximate date of sorts but seeing your reply above, never mind.
I'll leave you and the project alone to work.

madia84
Posts: 8
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 19:48

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by madia84 » 28 Mar 2010, 22:46

And further to Dag's comment, sorry but this kind of answer can't be accepted any longer, Mr Andrey.

You have accepted our money, haven't you? This is no freeware, it is commercial money-making stuff and nothing else. It is your responsibility to make it work decently, and a three-month period to fix the problems should have been amply sufficient.

Now if you are unable to supply us what we have paid for, you have only one solution (providing that you are decent people, naturally): if you can't make it work properly, then you have to face your responsibilities, to refund and to apologize for the disagreement you have caused.

snave
Posts: 220
Joined: 03 Sep 2006, 01:21
Location: United Kingdom

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by snave » 28 Mar 2010, 23:38

I've reviewed your post history Madia84, and find no evidence that YOU have ever had a problem?

So my question to you is, what's your agenda?

If there is no agenda, then why have you not detailed your system specs, and precisely what your problem is?
And why do you hide behind an anonymous alias and an incomplete user profile?

Obviously you have no problems, or else how you could possibly have had the time to construct eleven repaints when you were dealing with such `problems` alone, unaided, and without reference to the developers, the Support forum and the help of your fellow simmers is quite beyond me?

You must be a saint, with all that suffering in silence!
Simon Evans

madia84
Posts: 8
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 19:48

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by madia84 » 29 Mar 2010, 00:19

Well Snave you can have a look at this page: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=685&start=80 to see my repaints as they looked at the beginning of February, so roughly one month after the L-19 had been released. Rather quick reaction, isn't it? This was only Work In Progress, and things have improved since then. That post included a few suggestions about the MDL file, incidentally.

I haven't complained at that time about the problems that plague this L-19 since many people have done it, so it is not worth repeating the same thing again and again. I have just concentrated my efforts on repainting, hoping that Sibwings would eventually provide a decent base to the people who had paid for their commercial stuff. And I have even thought that those freeware (please note: FREEWARE) French repaints might have helped them selling their money-making product on the French market.

Now you can have a look at this post too: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=799 and so you might get aware of a few "very minor" snags regarding the overall shapes of this plane, that possibly have escaped many people but which, unfortunately, are quite conspicuous regardless of system specs.

I'm not a saint, I have simply kept quite for three months hoping that Sibwings would do their job. But they have not done it, and they now have to face their responsibilities.

You might be the kind of guy who pays for something and who then accepts for months, years and so on that it doesn't work properly. I am the kind of guy who thinks that three months are enough. Sibwings didn't need three months to accept my payment. What about yours?

snave
Posts: 220
Joined: 03 Sep 2006, 01:21
Location: United Kingdom

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by snave » 30 Mar 2010, 02:12

I didn't pay for mine. But then I DO offer suggestions and contributions to help with updating and problem-solving. You will accept, will you not, that it is rather strange to be piggy-backing everyone elses criticisms when you have made none of your own? Not even to justify or validate someone elses `problem`.

If you wish to assist in solving these problems, why wait until now? And why complete so many repaints when they will clearly need re-visiting in the event that a .mdl adjustment is made?

Your approach seems to be to try to stir a fire that few feel exists. Even you. For example, change the loadout and the `sit` of the aircraft in-sim changes quite perceptibly. If you cover a large number of Birddog images, as I have done, you will also see that there is a degree of inconsistency on the ground attitude of the plane IRL.
Image
Image
Image
Three photos, three distinctly different `splay` setups of the main gear...

A perfectly acceptable approach for your style of picking on `other peoples problems` is simply NOT to make the purchase until the problems are ironed out. Then you don't have them, do you? Such an approach has never failed me. There are NO developers who have released a bug-free, no-modification-required, no-problem-prone product for the FSX platform. NONE. Therefore the educated consumer who chooses to make an early purchase must, surely, realise that the product is likely to be updated, altered or amended after initial release?

Look forward to hearing further from you with your own problems, not merely echoing someone elses - which as we have seen may not even BE a problem...
Simon Evans

User avatar
thunderstreak
Posts: 6
Joined: 09 Dec 2006, 01:08

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by thunderstreak » 31 Mar 2010, 00:53

I wish to second the motion that an update is overdue.
I think the visual quality of this payware addon is great but....
I have purchased a ton of payware since I started in FS, some very good, some pretty poor, but have never experienced so many issues (goofy sound loops, missing switches, etc., etc.) with one that has taken so long to resolve.
Patches and updates are usually forthcoming in days or weeks, not months.
If you don't have the time to fix it, or the people to test it properly, then don't release it for money!!!
Image

madia84
Posts: 8
Joined: 31 Jan 2010, 19:48

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by madia84 » 31 Mar 2010, 03:56

I agree with your opinion in many respects, Thunderstreak. That's why I have bought this Cessna in its very early days, the advertising screenshots were so appealing! And I had been stupid enough to think that after more than one year of announced development and a thorough beta testing everything should be all right.

Yet after some afterthought and a thorough look at the hundreds of Bird Dog pictures I have I don't agree when you write that the visual quality of this payware addon is great. Just see below.

Now, to answer to Mr Snave's post (sorry, I should have written "Mr beta tester"), well, everybody can understand that you try to defend your position, Mr beta tester. But, from me to you, Mr beta tester, do you really think your position still can be defended?

Yes I know, Sibwings are very quiet about the subject now (what else could they do, by the way?), so they had to put Private Ryan in the forefront and you're trying to do your best.

It is not a question of "change the loadout and the `sit` of the aircraft in-sim changes quite perceptibly". Nearly everything is wrong in the overall shapes of this L-19.

I'm no longer talking about the way it sits on the ground, let's forget about that. What do you think about the fin and rudder shape?

Image


This one is self-speaking too, showing what the windshield and the glasshouse ought to look like. Let's forget once again about the way this machine sits on the ground, it is just a small detail.

Image


Now another aircraft, this is the machine that was used as a template by the developers as far as I can understand (but anyways all L-19s should have the same shapes, at least assuming from the many ones I saw in service). What about the slope of the rear cabin glazing, the size of the side windows, the shape of the engine cowling and of the windshield (once again), not to talk about such small details as the wheel covers and the width of the wing bracing struts – and not to talk about the position of those bracing struts either, naturally.

Image


Might be some other details have escaped you, Mr beta tester?

The fuselage is too wide and the cabin glazing of the wrong shape, as could be seen from a picture in my earlier post, and there it is once again

Image


At the same time this fuselage is pretty far from being deep enough, please have a second look at this picture.

Image


So you have beta-tested that stuff, Mr Snave, and you gave your agreement? If I were in your place, I wouldn't be very proud about it.

Yet you were right in one of your statements. My 11 repaints won't be of any great use if finally Sibwings manages to provide simmers what they have paid for (and what YOU have not paid for, incidentally, so this might explain we do not have the same kind of approach to the subject). But never mind, my work has been freeware (please remember: FREEWARE) and we definitely do not belong to the same world.

User avatar
Andrey
Site Admin
Posts: 834
Joined: 18 Sep 2005, 12:51
Location: Siberia
Contact:

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by Andrey » 31 Mar 2010, 16:54

Hey hey hey Michel,

Hope you have no objections that I call you by name ? I simply do not understand when people write such aggressive posts anonymously. You are looking for minor shape issues, do you really believe it's an engineering software? do you really believe other payware addons do not contain issues like these ? Btw fuselage thickness could be just optical illusion (point of view in FSX is closer than on real photo, it's obvious), as for your other claims about fuselage honestly I do not understand them at all, maybe other users can help me ?
If it is so important to you, you always can check screens on our site before buying, which is free btw :)

Flight dynamic - okay, I admited many times that we are not high professionals in this. But first, we really show files to real pilots and they approve them so or so. Second, for update we are looking for cooperation with people who are good at this, this is one of the reasons of delay.

Update will include, six new mdls, and around dozen repaints, sound fix is already on forum and you can test it
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=735

Then, if you find FSX payware addons development so money-coming busyness, as I told before - you are always welcome, with your own brand.
If you create better looking, more realistic, less price models - everybody will be just happy, including me ;)
But trust me, if you are working on high-quality add-ons it's a very time-killing work, you should know, I saw some of your repaints (not hi-end btw - but free, okay) income is not so great even for Russia, at this moment none of us can work only for Sibwings all day round. Besides that FS is becaming less and less popular, but add-ons should be more and more real, demanding more and more time for development.
So I do not exclude that I myself will find another work sooner or later. Leaving FS as hobby of course - will do freeware ;)

Finally, if you do not change your tone to snave, to our team - I'm sorry - I'll ban you here. Any constructive critics is welcome, but please without sharp corners. You may call us with bad words in any place all around Internet but not on this forum.

Sorry for my English, just emotions :)
Andrey
Image
We are at facebook: facebook.com/sibwings

sg38
Posts: 25
Joined: 03 Dec 2009, 18:58

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by sg38 » 01 Apr 2010, 00:02

>Finally, if you do not change your tone to snave, to our team - I'm sorry - I'll ban you here.

WHAT? Are you serious? Please note that "snave" simon evans has been banned from almost every important FS website in the meantime due to his let's say "questionable" behaviour combined with his very little RW experience! He did cost you already quite a few customers!!!

Proove? just click this link http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/s ... hp?t=33221

User avatar
Alex
Site Admin
Posts: 750
Joined: 18 Sep 2005, 01:08
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: When will the update be published ??

Post by Alex » 01 Apr 2010, 00:26

Guys, that's enough for personal "discussions" on this forum, please, use PM or email.

This forum is for BirdDog discussions only.
If you guys want to help us with update, you are welcome.
For developers prompt reply you can use support@sibwings.com email.
Also we'd appreciate your detailed buglists for an update via email.

Cheers!
Alex Petrochenko
SibWings developer

Locked